Which one do you think is the best backgammon server?

[yoel_bgorg]

Please, add an explanation to your answer and do not vote twice '' so we can understand what people are really thinking...

[Piranha]

This question cannot be answered, because it depends on each sites ever changing terms and conditions
For several years Truemoneygames used to be by far the best site, but lately they have turned into one of the worst
A few weeks ago BGRoom was the best for me, now they have raised their rakes to the sky and they are about the worst
PartyGammon used to be one of the worst sites, but after they recently terminated their rating system they have become attractive, even though they have a real bad software, they do have a lot of players

As the situation is on the web these days, a successful real money player will keep switching from one site to the other, always checking which site offers the best conditions, sometimes a small change in the rules of a specific site turns everything upside down

In general there is no "best site", only a temporary preferred one and while the sites keep competing against each other, every site trying to find THE perfect setup which attracts the most players, I guess we will have to keep checking and switching every now and then, depending on the following factors

- Ratings, a successful real money player will avoid any site that has a public rating system
- Rake, regardless how low it might become upon specific conditions, the ONLY thing that counts for me is the basic rake% upon minimum stakes without any possible reduction
- Players, the more players a site has the better
- Software/Server/Speed, the faster the connection and the better the comfort of playing, the better I like it

Note: This list is sorted by priorities, meaning if a site already has a rating, the lowest rake on the web still won´t attract me and the best software ever cannot even out for high rakes

As of today (see date of this post) PartyGammon is my preferred site, because they have no ratings and a lot of players, but I doubt it will be my preferred site for long, their rake is way too high, only in comparism with other sites they currently offer the lowest rakes in a non rated environment, but its only a question of time, until some other sites drop their ratings and/or lower their rakes and/or change their terms and/or upgrade their software

What I don´t understand within all this competition is, why do most sites insist on keeping their rating system, despite all facts?
When PartyGammon terminated their ratings, they didn´t even need much advertising, they had 1000s of new signups within days, but somehow most other sites don´t want to see this

[yoel_bgorg]

Hello Piranha and welcome to our forum.

First of all, I want to say that it is a pleasure to have you as a member in our forum, as a player considered one of the best in the online backgammon community. I hope that with time we will have all the best players in the offline and online backgammon community here as you and our moderator Phil Simborg. I know we are not in the same side but I will talk as a, let's say, beginner in the backgammon game. especially in the online version.

I will not talk about who is the best online backgammon server, I would like to discuss another thing you brought up; the rating system. I think that for players from the first league it may be good. because statistically, most of the times, you will find yourself playing against a player not as good as you are, but most other players will be on the other side.

As I probably will ...

and as much as I respect you, I would rather have a better chances with my bets.

[Piranha]

first of all, thanks for compliments, but naming me one of the best is really too much honor, maybe one of the best known, but far away from the best in skill

now let me see if I can show you the problem with ratings:

You showed the problem already, when you said
"I would rather have a better chances with my bets."

That is EXACTLY why a rating system kills real money activity

ALL players think like this, ALL player want to play an opponent where they have a good winchance, therefore, as soon as all players skills are public visible, no one plays anymore, simply because in any possible pairing there either is one underdog, who refuses the game, or (in pairings of even skill) BOTH players face a secure loss due the always present rake and neither of them is interested in a game

Of course there are exceptions, there are always a few players who don´t mind losing, even for real money, there are always a few weak players who see their loss against stronger players as a payment for the lesson and there are also a few players who overestimate themselves so much that they think they can beat higher rated players, but these are a tiny minority, or in other words, if a server has a rating system, they restrict their activity to a tiny minority of players

Furthermore a rating system attracts cheaters in vast numbers, players who lose on purpose upon small stakes, just to get a low rating and then fool others with it upon high stakes
I know companies like GE try to show their will to eliminate these cheaters, but the companies are very well aware that they depend on these players, because without them the activity on their server would be only a fraction of what it is with cheaters included
GE handles it kinda smart there, at least from the companies point of view, they let them play, generate a lot of rake and when they try to cash out GE confiscates their winnings, but from the players point of view this is the most unfair system one can imagine, advertisings saying "make money" sound like a very bad joke there

The recent example from PartyGammon clearly shows the difference between rated and non rated environments
Within days after they terminated their rating system they had 1000s of new signups and the activity in regular real money games and matches at PG has increased to a multiple of what it was before

I do understand the basic reason for having a rating system, cheaters aside, except of occasional streaks of luck there are no winners in a rated environment, meaning almost no withdrawls, almost 100% of all deposited money remains as profit for the server company

BUTTTTTTTTT

considered the fact that the amount of matches played in a rated environment is only a fraction of what it would be without ratings, the profit the server company makes is far less
100% profit out of 1% of players is simply less than 4 or 5% rake out of 100% of players

Last but not least, there are plenty of examples on the web proving that the ONLY way to attract active players is advertising, the more advertising, the more players will check out the server and their conditions, but as soon as they see a rating system most players stay away and even the most extensive advertising campaign cannot attract enough players from the tiny minority who don´t mind a rating to even out for the missing players who stay away only because there is a rating system present
The idea "we encourage matches between players of same skill" is based on the wrong assumption that anyone might be interested in a secure loss

[Piranha]

Reading it over, I noticed, I´ve shown the downside of ratings mostly from the server companies point of view
For me quite logic, there is no need to convince players how useless the ratings are, with the few exceptions I mentioned above, the only ones thinking a rating is a good thing are the server companies, because it gives them the option to setup progressive rake structures which make sure that even the few exceptions where a weak player chooses to play a higher rating do not allow the higher rating to make any profit for himself

Why I am so sure?

Some months ago I´ve setup a voting in the newsgroups, didn´t get many answers, but the few I got voted without any exception for NO ratings

Maybe a bit more weight can be put on a recent voting setup by BGroom in between their members with the result
Quote from BGRoom newsletter
"By an overwhelming majority our members voted NO to public ratings"